The Buddhist Hour Radio Broadcast Archives

Buddhist Hour
Script No. 378
Radio Broadcast live on Hillside 88.0 FM
for Sunday 24 April 2005CE
2547 Buddhist Era


“Knowing Honestly”
(Part 2 of Ajahn Thanasanti's talk)


Today's program is the second part in our two part series of a Dhamma talk that was given by Ajahn Thanasanti at our Centre on the 28th March 2005.

Ajahn Thanasanti was born in California in 1962. She completed a BA in Biology and worked for a few years as an analytical chemist before beginning training in 1989 as a Novice Nun at Amaravati Buddhist Monastery. She received ordination in 1992 at Amaravati and trained for 11 years in England at both Amaravati and Chithurst Buddhist Monasteries with Ajahn Sumedho as her Teacher. Ajahn Thanasanti has been leading Buddhist seminars since 1985 and teaching intensive meditation retreats internationally for many years. Her interest is integrating insight into the full human condition and using nature as a support in the practice.

Last weeks program contained a meditation and discussion on anatta, selflessness, and is now followed by additional commentary on the prerequisites for insight meditation.

We would like to thank Ajahn Thanasanti for the sharing of the Dhamma with us, and we wish that she may continue to teach for the benefit of many beings.

We continue on from last week:

Now, one of the challenges that we have in a Buddhist teaching is that there are many of us who come into our society, who come into a Buddhist community, come into a longing for spiritual awakening, and we come with history and some of the history is a mixture of positive and negative history.

And for some people they have some huge history, like some really catastrophic things that they have lived through. And sometimes this catastrophic history has come about when a person's a very young child.

A catastrophic history for a person who is a young child has a very detrimental effect on the child growing up. And so this sense of not knowing who they are and not feeling a sense of wholeness which is a healthy and natural byproduct of being born into a society, a culture, a family that is sufficiently safe, sufficiently loving, sufficiently encouraging of a sense of self.

Then we end up with this interesting dilemma, which is that psychologically we are in need of brining about psychological development to increase the psychological sense of self. We need the love, we need the knowing, we need the belonging, we need the safety, we need the wholeness, we need the fissures of our psyche heal.

So we need to know ourselves in order to know anatta.

That's right.

You have to have it before you can give it up.

It's not quite; it's actually two different things. The psychological sense of self is a different thing than the anatta. There is no inherent psychological self that is inherently present, but there's a sense of well being and wholeness and a sense of stability and inner strength. And one of the things in a Buddhist group needs to watch out for, because there are teachings with anatta, any time that there is a spiritual group of any sort there will be people who will flock to that community looking for refuge, but because Buddhist doctrine has within it the teachings of anatta, then particularly people who have a psychological issues who are fragile come because there is this hunger to heal and yet there isn't the knowledge of the work that is needed to heal. And so one thinks that if one wholeheartedly embraces the meditation and embraces the teachings of anatta that that is going to be the way out of this unbelievable despair. But this unbelievable despair is partly there because of woundedness and injury that needs holding, receiving, and healing before one is fully able to enter into deep experiences of meditation and release the ego grasping and any community is going to need to develop some psychological assessment skills to sort out what is useful for the individuals that come. Because what one person needs may be catastrophic for another person. So teachings are contextual, and what is useful is contextual. There is no absolute teaching.

So anatta is core and central teachings, but actually understand it and practice it requires foundations. Wholeness, a sense of wellbeing, a community basis to work with it. And that work is incredibly important and not in any way less meaningful, valuable, worthwhile, than other meditation work.

That is what we do here. We are a community and we support each other and we, everybody helps in the way that they can help. You know, we prepare meals and we offer food to each other. We really look after each other so that we can help each other support our practice. Help each other to keep five precepts. Help each other to have time to sit and meditate. We study the sutras. We study the commentaries on the teachings. And we really try to have that good foundation of in which we can build on and learn.

That is to be rejoiced, to be celebrated, to be respected, to be encouraged.

Thank you.

Now, are there any other questions that come up for you in your practice, or related to the subject, or another subject?

So, if one is having difficulties in actually to meditate because I understand that the practice of meditation is very useful, but I find it very challenging to just sit and meditate. Is that because I haven't found, or I'm having difficulties with the psychological part of the self? That I haven't go that wholeness yet to actually sit down and then I haven't, then I don't have that foundation yet, to actually sit in meditation?

I don't have enough information to say. Most people find meditation difficult. You know, and so just because you find meditation difficult that is common, doesn't necessarily mean where it is coming from. You know, the habit of our society is jam every sense organ as full as possible and then one sits still for a few minutes and one is expecting serene concentration and what you get is dribble of the stuff that has been stuffed in every possible way and one feels that somehow ones a failure in one's meditation, but is has something to do with the lifestyle that we lead and the lack of time and the overwhelming impact of sensory input and the pressure that one is under to do too much in too short a time and the lack of ability to allow things to just find their own ending. And so when one sits still all of the stuff is like this kind of pretzel that emerges and one thinks 'I'm a hopeless meditator'. Well, you're not a hopeless meditator. This is just the cause and effect result of what one has lived with. So one needs how to learn how to live to allow more space, to be present with things as they're arising, to allow them to settle. You know, to simplify. To have less rather than more. To spend more time out in nature with your hands dirty than, you know, behind the screen or reading or analysing, discussing. You know, to take your shoes off and walk barefoot. You know, those simple things. And so often it has to do with that.

So without knowing more, you and how, what is happening for you in your meditation and your personal story it would be hard to tell. I think many of us, it is wise to look at, you know, the spectrum because I think for many of us there are fissures that are present, we don't necessarily know them, but then something happens and the open up and then we know about them because were in a right state. So being able to get a sense of where these are and work to allow them to heal is also a part of our journey.

And then part of the other problem is is that we are habitually identified meditation with being sitting. You know, one sits. In the United States they don't even use the word meditation. They say, "I'm going to go sit with Ajahn Sumedho", or Jack Kornfield, you know. They don't even use the word meditate. So the word meditation and sitting in some people's minds is totally synonymous. Well, if you spend eight hours a day sitting in front of a telephone or in front of a computer, in front of people, you don't need to sit, you need to do something other than sitting.

So part of what is necessary is also to learn how to use your meditation in a way which is useful so that you are connecting and making good use of the time that you have for meditation. Sometimes what you need to do is gentle movement or standing or walking or lying down, you know. And so because our idea of meditation is fixed, you know, we see the Buddha mostly sitting, then we think well that how I'm supposed to do it. And then what we do is that we force ourself into a routine or a posture based on a concept of how it is supposed to be rather than really look at what is actually happening and what is needed right now. And that is also the problem, you know.

So meditation is about being present with what is arising and how we are relating to it and both working with the brining things into balance so that there is more skillfulness as well as learning how to allow the mind in it is own natural purity. So in this room there are all kind of objects and calligraphy and a shrine and beautiful red roses and Buddha statues and images of various kinds and I'm speaking and there's carpet and there's light and we'll get up and walk around and the lights will be turned off and tomorrow the sun will come and light will come from outside. The objects of the room are constantly changing. But the space isn't changing. The space doesn't change. And so with beautiful objects and unbeautiful objects or with nice Dhamma talks or with something that's frightening or threatening the space doesn't change. When the building falls down the space has not changed by the building's walls or absence of walls. But most of the time we are completely absorbed in the objects. We completely miss the space. So in addition to having the nice space where we cultivate a shrine, where we cultivate simplicity and ease and beauty, in addition to cultivating balance with objects we can learn to allow the mind to rest in a space for the same is true in our hearts. We need to bring balance to what we are experiencing but we need to learn to let the mind rest in its own innate purity.

Now, one's own innate purity is hard to rest in when one is absorbed in an object. But if the objects, if there's dust in the room or there's clutter in the room or there's a pile of jibber or non-stop talking, when you're not absorbed into any one of those objects you can still see that space. So, not having good concentration is not an obstacle for resting in the innate purity of the mind. It doesn't have to be.

But that is another place where we get confused, because we think meditation is concentration and if I'm not incredibly concentrated and able to watch the hair of the nostrils flicker with each inbreath then my meditation is poor. But concentration is an aspect of meditation and it's needed in order for there to be a certain capacity to be present with what is arising. But we can watch confusion, we can watch fogginess. Overwhelmed can be an object of meditation. This is overwhelmed, you know, it feels like this. So it doesn't have to be pristine and moment to moment and individuated and absolutely crystalline clear. That can be experienced but it's not required.

So again, part of the problem is the way that we relate to what meditation is and then we judge ourselves because it's not what we think it should be if were meditating properly.

Thank you.

Any other questions?

Which is, I guess that, is to follow up to that, is that like greed for a wrong view? Like, it should be like this. It's not like that but then the mind goes, 'It should be like that.' So, where does that come from? What drives that? What makes it occur?

We have a habitually tendency to shoot on ourselves (Laughs)! So we need to just recognise this as what it is, it's a shooting ourselves habit and see it for that. It's not the way it actually is, it's the way it should be. There's a difference and that habit is very deeply ingrained. It's driven by a sense of ill will rather than a sense of compassion.

So we need to just check what is actually happening, not what I think should be happening, what I would like to be happening, what could be happening, what is actually happening and how am I relating to it. Because we live our lives with this fantasy of what it is supposed to be like and then kind of blur and disconnect with how it actually is, because it's not fitting into our idea of how it should be. Do you understand what I'm saying? Does that resonate with your experience?

So it's humbling! I mean, sometimes it's sort of a humiliating! But what is actually happening is where the practice is alive.

So is the remedy to that, is it mindfulness, or is it honesty, or is a combination of different things?

It is a combination of those things. Interest, for me honesty is number one. Honesty. What is actually happening, because I come up with things like 'I'm sulking', 'I'm pouting', you know, it's like I don't, my concept of myself is that I don't sulk, you know. And so when I see that I'm sulking it's like hard to accept that. And then I don't accept it with this, and I shove it into this idea of what's happening, rather than actually accept it. So, honesty is a big thing.

And then does compassion come into that? Like, not being too hard on yourself?

What I do is I play. When I catch that I'm sulking and than catch that I'm resisting then I make it ten times worse and I go around and really pout, you know, and then I just act it out ten times worse so that I can release the anxiety and the tension out of not wanting to be like that.

(Laughs)

It's like you feed it.

Let it have its day.

It's like you embarrass it.

Well, because what for me the problem is is the resistance to not wanting it, that's what puts it in place. So if I make it ten times worse than it cuts through resistance and then there is nothing that holds it in place anymore and it falls away.
That happened to me just the other day around sadness. There were a few things that happened and I felt very sad but I couldn't accept that I felt sad. I couldn't accept it. So I was in a state in sort of blurred out numbness for like three-quarters of the day because I just couldn't accept that I was sad. You know, I had to take, I spent the morning meditating and the afternoon taking myself for a walk and I had to have a long talk with myself and say, 'I feel sad', you know, that's what's happening. I feel really sad. And once I could do that then the blur went away and the tension went away and the sadness, it's not that it completely evaporated, but it didn't have this kind of overriding...

Stickiness.

...stickiness to it. It was just something to be known, to be lived with and that was ok.

You say, "Feeling sad only."

(Laughs) Yeah. Sad bear. It's a sad bear day. It's ok to have sad bear days.

Because you're saying it's, you look at exactly what's happening, and the something that says, "Well, why is this happening to me", or whatever it might be, I guess I'm just working through that. Then there is nothing actually looking. Feeling arises, ah, angry, whatever it might be, so you're saying, ok honesty, that is angry arising. That's just the way it is. That is angry arising because causes in the past were made for angry to arise. I guess the chuckle of it is that, you say, "I'm noting angry is arising." If I put that question in, "Who Am I?", it seems to cut all that off, and it's just angry arising, because causes were made. So again that tool is a very powerful tool.

But where the compassion is needed is is that sometimes like the numbness around sadness or the numbness around anger touches in to these developmental tender places, were psychologically still working on having enough strength to allow these things to emerge without it being so threatening. So rather than needing a wisdom sword we need a warm gentle embracing, because there's still something that's tender which is still growing stronger, gently. Being able to allow these experiences without being threatened by them.

You can only do that when you feel safe and secure.

So that really needs the gentleness rather than the cutting.

That's being honestly kind to yourself.
When there is grasping then that can benefit with this very powerful cutting of just, "Who am I? Who is grasping? Who am I?" So, you have different situations and they require different remedies and that's where the skill is because it takes a certain amount of inner knowing to be able to get a feeling for what is required in different situations because it looks like same thing but it's coming from totally different places.

I'd like to know more about common sense.

Common sense. What to say about common sense. I'm not sure how to answer the question really. I know, I don't know whether it is a combination of head injuries or the meditation but there are certain aspects of my brain that simply don't function the way it used to (Laughs). Like, I don't have a capacity to plan the way I used to and to organise things the way I used to. I can organise things specifically, but I can't sequentially sort things out. And so the result of this for me is is that I've had to learn how to trust my intuition rather than try and sort it all out and plan it all out and get it all organised out there. I have to just let it go, and just trust that a something will emerge which will allow it to find its own resting. And what I have found, when I do this, when I learn how to trust my intuition is often there are things like, I feel frustrated because I'm not able to get it organised only to find out that had I organised it before, I would have had to re-organise it because something has shifted.

So there is something like, an internal wisdom which operates, something operates that's almost like a some kind of deeper knowing that's in charge of things that I have no conscious awareness of. So, simplicity is a way to return to the present moment. Simplicity is a way to be in touch with the body and the breath and what's just arising in the present. Simplicity is a way of dismantling the story that is created around experience and perception and feeling, and just coming back to the immediacy of what's happening. The way we get to simplicity is through unveiling the reaction and the reaction to what's happening.

So for example, like the sadness, so there was sadness and there was not wanting the sadness and then there was some kind of a numbness around it. So I had sadness, not wanting, and numbness, and before I could get to the sadness I had to receive the numbness, breathe through the not wanting, and then just allow the sadness to be there.

So the way to arrive at simplicity is to be aware of what is actually happening in the present moment and how am I relating to it. And you will maybe have layers, that the top layer is the one that you know and that's the one you need to learn how to relate to with skill. The top layer then will lift and release and shift then you see the layer underneath it. And that's the one you need to embrace and relate to with skill. That will release and shift and move and come underneath and then that is the one you need to relate to.

So simplicity is about being able to be clear about what's happening and how you're relating to it. And that process will bring you back to the present moment.

May all beings become fully enlightened.
May all beings have true, lasting happiness.
May all beings find true friends in the Dhamma.

This script was spoken by Ajahn Thanasanti and was prepared and edited by Frank Carter, Lainie Smallwood and Alec Sloman.

References:

Recording Title: 'Who am I?' part II
CD 2 of 2
Teacher: Ajahn Thanasanti
Date of recording: 28/03/2005
Transcribed by: Alec Sloman
Checked by:
CD Reference: 28_03_05T1S2
FileName I:\28_03_05T1S2A_JDHtranscribe.rtf

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